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England Team v Germany, 19 November

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If townsend's overrated, then what about rooney, Gerrard and all? At least he showed something, not a lot, but he gave us some attacking intent...as for next summer, all I hope is that we get out of the group, but even that looks a big ask

 
What's with the Townsend hate, he was the only one doing anything.

 
The Brit said:
...as for next summer, all I hope is that we get out of the group, but even that looks a big ask
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I think it's all about managing expectations.  It's like Chelsea years back - you didn't expect to win the league, but have something to cheer along the way.  That's all I expect realistically from England.

 
Zola said:
Do you honestly think England will win? I really doubt it to be honest!

I know Germany are resting loads of players, but Germany is Germany.
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what I meant was that if we had won it would have been a fluke.

 
Remodez said:
What's with the Townsend hate, he was the only one doing anything.
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By anything you mean running down blind alleys, cutting back and losing it. He did one thing, a lash which hit the post. He, along with sturridge and cleverly was dreadful.
 
I said right at the start of this thread that I'd laugh if the Germans fielded their B <> C team and still beat Englands "A" team.

Many laughs were had tonight. 

Sad, sarcastic, and alcohol-fueled laughs...

If we cannot even beat the reserve team the Germans have then we're seriously f**ked next year.

 
Izanagi said:
I said right at the start of this thread that I'd laugh if the Germans fielded their B <> C team and still beat Englands "A" team.

Many laughs were had tonight. 

Sad, sarcastic, and alcohol-fueled laughs...

If we cannot even beat the reserve team the Germans have then we're seriously f**ked next year.
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I don't see anything funny about losing. If you are not going to support England then stop saying we when you are talking about them. Lack of support is as bad as England players apparently not trying hard enough, which is something they get accused of a lot.

 
I think the problems we had are general rather than linked to one or other players.

We are still not playing our natural game. Where's the pace of our domestic football?

We are not comfortable in possession. That's a basic issue.

We take too many touches and this slows the pace of our attacks. A lot of the time we come forward in what looks like slow motion - our passes, etc are predictable.

We can't have good halfs - not at the World Cup. If we play better in the second half than the first or play only once we're behind it's going to be too late.

Looking at the Germans, they had a more consitent level of skill and assurance in possesion. When we had the ball and were in their half we were challenged and harried; none of this backing off of attacking players that we seem to do.

I don't like writing this. There were positives last night but we will get found out next year I reckon.

 
dkw said:
By anything you mean running down blind alleys, cutting back and losing it. He did one thing, a lash which hit the post. He, along with sturridge and cleverly was dreadful.
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Don't see everyone's fascination with him either - one-trick pony and all that, and when that doesn't go well he has precious little to make up for it.

Spudulike said:
I think the problems we had are general rather than linked to one or other players.

We are still not playing our natural game. Where's the pace of our domestic football?

We are not comfortable in possession. That's a basic issue.

We take too many touches and this slows the pace of our attacks. A lot of the time we come forward in what looks like slow motion - our passes, etc are predictable.

We can't have good halfs - not at the World Cup. If we play better in the second half than the first or play only once we're behind it's going to be too late.

Looking at the Germans, they had a more consitent level of skill and assurance in possesion. When we had the ball and were in their half we were challenged and harried; none of this backing off of attacking players that we seem to do.

I don't like writing this. There were positives last night but we will get found out next year I reckon.
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Spot on with this, Spud. I highlighted the majority of England's problems in another thread. Many argue that this emphasis on pace and power over imagination and intricate movement placed in the domestic leagues has a negative impact on England on the international stage - it's become the custom to blame the league but it's blatantly false. We don't play like that, City don't, nor do you lot and Arsenal haven't for a very long time. They play this short, quick-tempo game with the players that are suited for it. England, regardless of their dearth of quality compared to a Spain or Germany, do have the players that can excel in those systems (though somewhat of a rarity) but the national team's approach is hardly conducive to it.

As I said in the other post ideally you look to find a happy medium between the physical and technical sides of the game - the English game certainly needs some refinement of the latter but you're not completely incapable of it. The problem lies in getting the NT to play cohesively, fluidly and with more urgency, as you say, but this doesn't look like getting fixed any time soon.

 
Beerqueen said:
Watching Sturridge tonight is just like watching him when he was at Chelsea.
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So Right.

I'm still a bit gutted that we let Sturridge go to the dippers but although I want England to do well, last night helps make it easier to accept. He was woeful. Last night was a great example of why he gets labelled a selfish and lazy player.

Can't understand the criticism of Townsend though he was our best player by a country mile. Sure his decision making was rather Walcot like and his final ball has to improve but at least he made the German defence work and he regularly took 2 or 3 of their defenders out of the game.

I'm getting fed up saying it but we have to axe the old guard NOW and start building for 2018 / 2020. Bring in the U '21's and blend them with the likes of Townsend, Gibbs, Lallana, Wiltsher and stop playing Gerrard, Lamps, Cole, Milner and co. Even Rooney is questionable. On his day he's a good player but World Class? I can't stand the thought of watching the same old dross fail so miserably in Brazil next year. At least if we went with youngsters it would be a positive move for the future.

 
Remodez said:
Couldn't care less what club they play for once they put the England shirt on.
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Fine, but let's have a laugh while the latest media darling prooves he's not as good as they crack him up to be. Didn't it grate with you in the past hearing Terry, Lampard and Cole get booed just because they were Chelsea players. It's something I'll never forgive or forget and bearing in mind a lot of those doing it were probably Tottenham fans.

 
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Thought Townsend was very lively myself, dragged 2 or 3 players way out of position to deal with him. If he had more support at times he could have done more. He is a real handful and at 22, he will only get better. Bags of pace, and unlucky not to score.

England are clearly lacking a leader at the back. Are there any more international friendlies coming up in the next few months? If Terry keeps his performances up with CFC the press will be begging him back if England keep leaking goals like this. Germany played their B team and beat England more than comfortably. Two defeats in 2 games, at Wembley...clearly not good enough.

There's no grit or balls at the back. Thought Jagielka did ok, as did Cole. Smalling is not an international player.

Roy made the team infinitely weaker by bringing on Jordan Henderson and Gibbs. Both those players, especially Henderson, are not internationals. They are awful!

 
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I won't lie, I didn't watch the game... I just can't get excited about watching England play, especially friendlies.

 
Also bear in mind Townsend appeared to have a good game in a friendly where tackling is almost non-existent.

 
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