OK I'll add my 2 bob's worth!Starting with the Hillborough disaster, because thats what it was, a disaster. Innocent football fans killed at a football match, its a tragedy!!
I use the term innocent because a majority of those killed were at the front and not responsible for the cause of events. The stewards and ground officials could have ''opened the gates'' at the edge of the pitch earlier to ease the overcrowding. The police ''opened the gates'' outside to allow more supporters into the ground. AND like it or not Liverpool fans WITHOUT tickets did contribute to this disaster by trying to gain entry without paying or without a ticket.
Why did the police allow more fans inside when it was already overcrowded? That was and should have been the underlying question to this investigation. The police's response was because of the safety fears outside the ground for the surges that were pushing towards the turnstiles.
Arguements aside, who's fault it was etc, the fact is that many innocent football fans who went to watch an FA semi final never made it home that day. There were lessons to be learnt, but going back to the arguement, I still honestly believe standing areas could be deployed safely rather than just saying, right everyones gotta sit down!
This was the reason for the Taylor reports and for his recommendations into all seater stadia.
Liverpool fans were not totally, but I must admit partly responsible for the events. In saying that, the 'draw' of Liverpool at the time and their vast following ''Liverpool'' could be replaced by any other club. But you cannot rewrite history so unfortunately ''Liverpool'' it was.
I won't even attempt to go into defending Liverpool supporters for what happend in Turin or on the way home from Turkey, (I wasn't me it was a different Liverpool fan), because I can't. It's another arguement all together.
I will mention, more recently though, Millwall were fined due to ''failing to control supporters'' in a game at the new Den against Liverpool. This was, by the way, for Liverpool, yes, LIVERPOOL supporters trying to get onto the pitch and ripping their seats up.
These are also the same Liverpool supporters that wrecked old trafford scrawlling the 'Munich 58'', ''Harold shipman'' in their toilets and rocking an ambluance containing an injured player on his way to hospital.
I don't want to start raising particluar events or mud slinging because I'm sure there are certain individuals who do and will be bring shame on our club in issolated incidents. But your incidents are not 'what a kid did at a train station', they involved more than one or two supporters of your club, and have been talked about worldwide!
It great to have 'history' but it cannot be swept away or brushed aside at the earliest convenience. It's even better to learn from history, something I don't thing Liverpool, or at least their supporters have done.
I'm sure your a decent supporter/bloke RedRob and have enjoyed several of your threads, but you are defending people you probably wouldn't enjoy spending an holiday with. Every club has it's scummy attraction but in todays climate your's seem to attract more than the norm. Only my opinion, but from personal experience.
The suspension from European competition without doubt effected Liverpool more than ANY other English club, you have not won a league since and were eclipsed by Manu your bitterest rival in the equation!
Some once said....
We were born by chance, live for no reason, all we can do is fill in the gaps by learning from our mistakes.
To the rest of the world Liverpool don't seem to have done that.
Sitting with one leg over the fence,
Bluenut
